For Funsies: Conference Reallignment/Creation

DisplacedRam

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Mar 21, 2017
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any two of the three would hurt. So what's the plan to keep that from happening? ........an if you ae not planning then you are probably he third team in that scenario

true. much more likely that two top teams run off and elope somewhere than three at once. I would assume and hope that these things are major points of discussion high up in the AD year round.
 
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VCU Heel

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Aug 7, 2012
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DB is spot on. I'd rather be in the PacLantic 13 than this incarnation of the AAC.
The downside of our current situation is that we could become financially screwed if we have a few down years and miss the tourney. It’s nice getting that larger share of our own NCAA Tourney money when we’re making it 6-7 years in a row. We’ve only earned 2 shares in the last 4 years though.

The upside of being in a conference like the AAC models being speculated about is that you can still do well financially even through down years. That conference would get a much better media deal/payout than the current A10. Throw in the conference averaging 6-7+ teams in the tournament each year with a few of them winning games and the decreased NCAA Tourney share isn’t that big of a deal. I definitely think the VCU athletic department generates a lot more money from being in that kind of conference than they do now. And this doesn’t even take into account better ticket and donation revenues that would come with having a much more appealing home schedule.

That said, I don’t want to be in a conference with Liberty or Georgia State. There would need to be a few tweaks to that conference before I’d be totally on board. But the tweaks would have to take into account having at least a 12-14 team FBS football conference (after you include Army and Navy as football-only schools).
 
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VCU Heel

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But my dream scenario would be:

East Division:
Connecticut
Providence
Seton Hall
St. John’s
Villanova
Georgetown
VCU

West Division:
Creighton
St. Louis
Marquette
DePaul
Butler
Xavier
Dayton

And I emphasize “dream” because it’s never going to happen. That‘s a 7-8+ bid league that would have a massive TV deal.

There could be either a 19 game schedule (2 against each team in your division + 1 against each team in the other division) or a 20 game schedule that would be easier for scheduling where you would add a 2nd game against one team from the other division that could be a the same rival team every year. I’d match VCU and Dayton in that scenario.

A sample Stu home conference schedule might look something like Connecticut, Providence, Seton Hall, St. John’s, Villanova, Georgetown, Dayton, Creighton, Marquette, Butler. Then the next year would be Connecticut, Providence, Seton Hall, St. John’s, Villanova, Georgetown, Dayton, St. Louis, DePaul, Xavier.
 
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TampaKAP

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But my dream scenario would be:

East Division:
Connecticut
Providence
Seton Hall
St. John’s
Villanova
Georgetown
VCU

West Division:
Creighton
St. Louis
Marquette
DePaul
Butler
Xavier
Dayton

And I emphasize “dream” because it’s never going to happen. That‘s a 7-8+ bid league that would have a massive TV deal.

There could be either a 19 game schedule (2 against each team in your division + 1 against each team in the other division) or a 20 game schedule that would be easier for scheduling where you would add a 2nd game against one team from the other division that could be a the same rival team every year. I’d match VCU and Dayton in that scenario.

A sample Stu home conference schedule might look something like Connecticut, Providence, Seton Hall, St. John’s, Villanova, Georgetown, Dayton, Creighton, Marquette, Butler. Then the next year would be Connecticut, Providence, Seton Hall, St. John’s, Villanova, Georgetown, Dayton, St. Louis, DePaul, Xavier.
While we are dreaming, when this happens, I'll get a condo on Marshall behind the Stu and just live there during basketball season with a schedule like that
 

BaNgMyPrOgRaM

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Mar 27, 2009
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Actually I would be fine with this small conference.

East Division:
Temple
Cincinnati
Dayton
VCU
ODU
East Carolina/Charlotte
Central Florida
South Florida
 
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Feb 8, 2010
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Throw in the conference averaging 6-7+ teams in the tournament each year with a few of them winning games and the decreased NCAA Tourney share isn’t that big of a deal. I definitely think the VCU athletic department generates a lot more money from being in that kind of conference than they do now. And this doesn’t even take into account better ticket and donation revenues that would come with having a much more appealing home schedule.

I'm not sure where you're getting 6-7 bids on average out of the American; the conference has never sent more than four teams to the dance even when they had Louisville and UConn. If you're assuming we make the dance every season to add to that total in the American, why wouldn't you assume that with us in the A10 or any other conference?

I wouldn't want us to be in any incarnation of the American. Cincinnati, Memphis, and Houston all have eyes on the Big 12, and if the next round of conference realignment grants two of those three their wish, the remaining conference has the same bloated geography without nearly the brand cache of the current conference. Trading in complaints about Fordham's ineptitude for East Carolina's, and complaints about road games at Saint Louis for road games at SMU, Tulsa, and Tulane wouldn't be worth being able to share a conference with Wichita State and whichever of the three schools doesn't get scooped up by the B12.

Obviously the Big East would be the best possible scenario, but I don't see it happening.
 

VCU Heel

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Aug 7, 2012
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I'm not sure where you're getting 6-7 bids on average out of the American; the conference has never sent more than four teams to the dance even when they had Louisville and UConn. If you're assuming we make the dance every season to add to that total in the American, why wouldn't you assume that with us in the A10 or any other conference?

I wouldn't want us to be in any incarnation of the American. Cincinnati, Memphis, and Houston all have eyes on the Big 12, and if the next round of conference realignment grants two of those three their wish, the remaining conference has the same bloated geography without nearly the brand cache of the current conference. Trading in complaints about Fordham's ineptitude for East Carolina's, and complaints about road games at Saint Louis for road games at SMU, Tulsa, and Tulane wouldn't be worth being able to share a conference with Wichita State and whichever of the three schools doesn't get scooped up by the B12.

Obviously the Big East would be the best possible scenario, but I don't see it happening.
We’re not discussing the current AAC. We’re discussing a new AAC with this kind of makeup:

East Division:
Temple
Cincinnati
Dayton
VCU
ODU
East Carolina/Charlotte
Central Florida
South Florida

West Division:
Wichita State
St. Louis
Tulsa
SMU
Houston
Memphis
UAB
Tulane

Cincy, Dayton, VCU, Wichita St, Memphis, and Houston are NCAA regulars. UCF, St Louis, SMU, and Temple get there some too. It’s a very different conference from what the AAC currently is.
 
Feb 8, 2010
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We’re not discussing the current AAC. We’re discussing a new AAC with this kind of makeup:

[members]

Cincy, Dayton, VCU, Wichita St, Memphis, and Houston are NCAA regulars. UCF, St Louis, SMU, and Temple get there some too. It’s a very different conference from what the AAC currently is.
I'm aware. I saw the original tweet and I still want nothing to do with such a conference.

UCF made the NCAAs in 2019. Prior to that, their last tournament appearance was in 2004 as a 15-seed. SMU similarly needed a (now-retired) Hall-of-Fame coach to beat their 21-year NCAA Tournament drought. Saint Louis likewise had the late Rick Majerus. I wouldn't expect any of these programs to turn the corner and suddenly become teams that make the dance more often than they miss it.

I already mentioned Cincinnati, Memphis and Houston. They all have one foot out the door. If the Big 12 calls, they're gone. Which leaves Dayton (who is already in the A10) and Wichita State (who had great success under Gregg Marshall but is no sure thing under Isaac Brown; the program made the NCAA Tournament just once between 1988 and 2012) as teams that could reasonably be expected to be the flagship basketball programs in such a conference (besides ourselves).

ODU chose football. Charlotte chose football. UAB chose football. Tulane hasn't made the NCAAs since 1995. ECU has never been respectable, let alone good, in basketball. Temple has struggled in recent years. USF has made three trips to the NCAAs in the history of their program. I don't see any of these programs taking a leap forward and contending for at-large bids in the near future either.

Throw in the far higher travel costs, and the negatives outweigh the positives. There's no possible way I can see this conference being considered on par with the P5 in football or P6 in basketball. Hard pass.
 
Feb 16, 2017
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I'm not sure where you're getting 6-7 bids on average out of the American; the conference has never sent more than four teams to the dance even when they had Louisville and UConn. If you're assuming we make the dance every season to add to that total in the American, why wouldn't you assume that with us in the A10 or any other conference?

I wouldn't want us to be in any incarnation of the American. Cincinnati, Memphis, and Houston all have eyes on the Big 12, and if the next round of conference realignment grants two of those three their wish, the remaining conference has the same bloated geography without nearly the brand cache of the current conference. Trading in complaints about Fordham's ineptitude for East Carolina's, and complaints about road games at Saint Louis for road games at SMU, Tulsa, and Tulane wouldn't be worth being able to share a conference with Wichita State and whichever of the three schools doesn't get scooped up by the B12.

Obviously the Big East would be the best possible scenario, but I don't see it happening.
Inclined to agree. My thoughts are that we're pretty much stuck in the A-10.
 
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GuardTheArc

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For a 30,000+ student public school without a football program or a religious affiliation, we are actually quite fortunate to be in the A-10.

1) A-10 has turned out to be our NCAA-qualifying "sweet spot" - just easy enough to garner 20+ wins nearly every season and be at or near the top of the conference and just tough enough to supply the necessary rigor and metrics (NET, KP, Top 100 wins, etc) to garner (qualify for) an at-large bid almost annually. That's where you want to be. I'm quite sure this (at-large bids and the associated prestige/revenue/scheduling/national press/recruiting advantages) is what UR envisioned when they made the jump to the A-10.

2) A-10 provides a favorable geography - driving distance (i.e. crowd support/enthusiasm) to many rival games -- UR, GMU, GW, Davidson, even Dayton -- and the conference tourney.

3) A-10 provides a favorable NCAA units payout structure - keep 75% of annual unit revenue earned

Ultimately, for most schools, especially those without big-time football, making the NCAA tourney in men's hoop is the big prize/goal each year.

Dayton, St Louis, Richmond, Rhody, and St Bonny are not as sexy as AAC members Cincy, Memphis, Houston, Wichita, Temple, this is true. However, the ultimate prize occurs on Selection Sunday each year and the A-10 has delivered (to us at least) beyond our wildest dreams (9 NCAA selections in the past 10 NCAA tourneys held).

Sometimes in life you need to know who you are, stay in your lane, carve out your own (successful if not glamorous) path. and stick with what works. The A-10 has been a home run thus far for VCU athletics (and all who follow/support it).