Joe Bamisile’s waiver denied by NCAA

[RamLover]

If his father's health and his own mental health are the issues here then playing basketball should be way down his priority list.

Not if it’s what he loves to do. He’s said in the statement that VCU was a team with resources to support him.

Random people on the internet aren’t the best to tell someone with mental health issues how to make it better. Everyone is different, and his path for healing will be unique to him.

 

[rammad90]

Let Joe play!

Sick parent, heart surgery. Young man. I can see why he'd want to be home. I understand the stress of thinking your parent might not survive. The NCAA is heartless.

 

[rammad90]

If his father's health and his own mental health are the issues here then playing basketball should be way down his priority list.

What if basketball is a sort of therapy for him. A few hours a day he can get away. A chance to focus on something else.

It probably what he knows and something him and his Dad spent a lot of time working on. A distraction if you will.

The alternative is sitting around having to deal with your issues with no relief.

 

[VCU Heel]

Outside of how much this sucks for Joe and the fact that it hurts VCU next season, I think decisions like this are better for VCU basketball in the long term.

When we get transfers to VCU in the future, we can feel more confident that they’ll stay here for more than one year because they’ll know they could be forced to sit out if they transfer again. This is why I think VCU should transition away from most high school recruits and go more for transfers that won’t be able to leave as easily if they have one good year.

Has anyone heard anything about Efton Reid and whether he’ll be able to play next year at Wake Forest? By these standards, he should have to sit out a year too.

 

[AlienAiden]

Outside of what this means for Joe and the fact that it hurts VCU next season, I think decisions like this are better for VCU basketball in the long term.

When we get transfers to VCU in the future, we can feel more confident that they’ll stay here for more than one year because they’ll know they could be forced to sit out if they transfer again. This is why I think VCU should transition away from most high school recruits and go more for transfers that won’t be able to leave as easily if they have one good year.

Has anyone heard anything about Efton Reid and whether he’ll be able to play next year at Wake Forest? By these standards, he should have to sit out a year too.

Yeah, I cannot imagine Reid getting a waiver either. He left LSU for Gonzaga now at Wake. His best chance would have been at VCU but he would most likely have been denied here.

 

[RowdyPkunk]

Outside of what this means for Joe and the fact that it hurts VCU next season, I think decisions like this are better for VCU basketball in the long term.

When we get transfers to VCU in the future, we can feel more confident that they’ll stay here for more than one year because they’ll know they could be forced to sit out if they transfer again. This is why I think VCU should transition away from most high school recruits and go more for transfers that won’t be able to leave as easily if they have one good year.

Has anyone heard anything about Efton Reid and whether he’ll be able to play next year at Wake Forest? By these standards, he should have to sit out a year too.

It also may make some students stop transferring just to transfer because they're not getting the playing time / role they want, or transferring for more NIL Money.... for fear of a situation like Joe's happening where he needs to transfer to be closer to home, but can't because he's already transferred multiple times before.

I have no doubt in my mind that's the message the NCAA is trying to send here. They're not going to let someone play for 4 schools in 4 years without having to sit. Had they let Joe play..... that woulda opened the flood gate for everyone else. Sure he got a transfer waiver to play right away at OU due to Mental Health..... but a devils advocate might ask..... "if he was having Mental Health issues at the time.... Why not move closer to home versus get further & further away? Why go from DC (where he's a 2-ish hour car ride away from home) to Norman Oklahoma where he'd have to take a flight & likely have a layover/transfer point somewhere.... and much further away from home.


Obviously, when he went to OU at first, I would assume there was no plan to transfer to another school for his senior year.... and certainly he didn't plan for his father to have heart issues.... but looking at his track record of constantly changing his mind on where he's going to school (for one reason or another).... the NCAA probably said enough is enough.

One has to wonder.... if he hadn't transferred from Tech to GW after 1 year (especially since it wasn't due to a coaching change).... and had only transferred twice (once due to Mental Health).... if the NCAA still woulda denied his transfer request. Maybe they would've, maybe they wouldn't have. Who knows?

But I think this is the NCAA sending a message to all athletes that they are gonna start cracking down on these non stop transfers.... just so happens unfortunately, the kid from UNC Football & Joe Bamisile are being used as the examples.

I hope Joe can win his appeal.... but I'll be very shocked if he does.... based on the message it looks like the NCAA is trying to send here.

 

[TampaKAP]

Outside of what this means for Joe and the fact that it hurts VCU next season, I think decisions like this are better for VCU basketball in the long term.

When we get transfers to VCU in the future, we can feel more confident that they’ll stay here for more than one year because they’ll know they could be forced to sit out if they transfer again. This is why I think VCU should transition away from most high school recruits and go more for transfers that won’t be able to leave as easily if they have one good year.

Has anyone heard anything about Efton Reid and whether he’ll be able to play next year at Wake Forest? By these standards, he should have to sit out a year too.

so let me just make sure I understand this correctly. Your position is that the system should be structured is such a manner that limits a players options. I am not a fan of it personally but as that seems to be the path forward then after year one, lets make all scholarships guaranteed for three more years and if a coach decides to show a player the door then the coach (and I say coach because it should follow them if they go to another school) should lose a scholarship for the following year. If the collective you would be willing to hold coaches to the same standard, then the collective me would more readily accept the sit rule

 

[VCU Heel]

so let me just make sure I understand this correctly. Your position is that the system should be structured is such a manner that limits a players options. I am not a fan of it personally but as that seems to be the path forward then after year one, lets make all scholarships guaranteed for three more years and if a coach decides to show a player the door then the coach (and I say coach because it should follow them if they go to another school) should lose a scholarship for the following year. If the collective you would be willing to hold coaches to the same standard, then the collective me would more readily accept the sit rule

I’m not saying anything about what the rule should or shouldn’t be when it comes to transfers. I am saying that not allowing unlimited transfers without the player having to sit out a year is better for VCU basketball in the long run.

 

[TampaKAP]

I have no doubt in my mind that's the message the NCAA is trying to send here. They're not going to let someone play for 4 schools in 4 years without having to sit.

So much like NCAA Men playing two halves and everywhere else in the world basketball is played in 4 quarters, the NCAA is heck bent on being different? I can't think of a single other place from rec league to pro league that would impose a limit of how many teams you can play on in a given timeframe.

 

[TampaKAP]

I’m not saying anything about what the rule should or shouldn’t be when it comes to transfers. I am saying that not allowing unlimited transfers without the player having to sit out a year is better for VCU basketball in the long run.

Fair enough and I respect the heck out of you for saying what a lot of people think but one say and that is what matters is what best for the school and not the players. We may disagree but again nothing but respect for your willingness to say it out loud

 

[VCU Heel]

Fair enough and I respect the heck out of you for saying what a lot of people think but one say and that is what matters is what best for the school and not the players. We may disagree but again nothing but respect for your willingness to say it out loud

Personally, I think players should probably have freedom to move as much as they want without sitting out. This is a for-profit business and for many of these players their 4-5 years in college could be the highest earning potential years of their lives. The programs and coaches aren’t bound to their players, so the players shouldn’t be bound to their programs and coaches. If programs want the players to be stuck with them, then they should give the players a contract with salary and benefits (in particular health insurance that covers their injuries even after they leave). It’s extremely hypocritical for some schools to have more than a hundred million dollars a year in revenues and for players to have to chose between staying at places they aren’t happy or sit out a year... particularly when they aren’t getting a slice of the multi-billion dollar pie. NIL helps, but not for everyone.

That said, from a VCU basketball perspective where we can’t compete financially with the big boys and don’t provide the kind of national stage that most of these players seek, this is probably a good decision for the long term health of the program. And it definitely should change our recruiting strategy from mostly high school kids with the occasional transfer to mostly transfers with the occasional high school kid.

 

[Valley drop step]

Per several I spoke with yesterday, they're appealing and feel good about his/their chances.

It's disappointing to see some selfishly, poorly thought out opinions in this thread.
WHO is to say someone hasn't been ridden more times than seattle slew, kicked to the curb like a refillable lighter someone doesn't wish to take the time to fill, and should be prohibited from playing close to home to be able to support their family and still play the game they love?

Kat and I support the young man. I learned first hand very recently that there's no disputing the fact he's already a very strong part of the VCU Family.
We all should be standing aligned in support of him.

An appeal seems redundant - presenting the same information to the same organization. Is there a higher body within the NCAA? Will anything change in the next month? Probably not. Apparently, the situation did not meet the criteria. He will either use his 4th year of eligibility this year or next. Not a big deal either way. 4 schools in 4 years would be saying there are no transfer rules. Fine, dissolve all the transfer rules, it’s an illusion anyway. But until then, hold the line.

 

[RowdyPkunk]

So much like NCAA Men playing two halves and everywhere else in the world basketball is played in 4 quarters, the NCAA is heck bent on being different? I can't think of a single other place from rec league to pro league that would impose a limit of how many teams you can play on in a given timeframe.

You can't compare rec-league & pro league to college.... I'm sorry you just can't.

Rec league people bounce around because some people just play for the love of the game & others wanna be on the best teams & win.

I'll use myself as an example..... I played rec league baseball & basketball.... I was far from the best at either..... I just played for my love of the game & to make to friends & have a good time. Sure I was competitive & wanted to win.... but I wasn't out here dreaming of being a college or pro athlete.... cause I knew that wasn't in my future with the cards I was dealt.

Plus when you (or your parents) are spending money on sports as kids.... they want you to enjoy it & actually be able to play. I ultimately gave up playing rec league baseball because I was tired of riding the bench or being put in positions in the field that I didn't enjoy, just so that other, better kids could play where they wanted 24/7. Some coaches I had, were awesome & gave the lesser talented kids like myself a chance to play different positions & see where they were good at or what they enjoyed instead of just putting people places & leaving them there. Other coaches I had.... didn't give a flying f*** what players like myself wanted..... and made the game a lot less enjoyable.

I'm sorry Rec-League (not AAU or travel ball) should not be like that..... Not even remotely comparable to College Ball. NOT EVEN CLOSE.



And Pro leagues are different too for multiple reasons. For one, as a pro.... you can negotiate deals.... whether its 1 year, 4 years or 10 years. Full or Partial No Trade Clauses, and of course the money terms of the deal. If a player wants to sign nothing but 1 year deals & keep his option open, he usually can. If a player is good enough & a team wants to lock him up for a long term deal & give the player more money to keep him there longer... they can. Look at deals that players like Mike Trout, Bryce Harper, Patrick Mahomes, Aaron Judge, Nikola Jokic & others have signed in the last 5 years or so. All long term, big money deals.

Then you factor in.... if a player wants to get traded.... That team has gotta make a trade with another team & come to agreement of what that team is getting in return.

If a player wants to get released.... they gotta be willing to give up money on their contract.... and if the Coach/GM wants to release a player... depending on how the contract is laid out.... they may owe the player part of their remaining salary.


The other major difference between Rec League/Pro league & college is..... in Rec/Pro leagues.... no one is being required to attend classes & keep their GPA above a certain level. Also, in rec/pro leagues... players aren't being given scholarships to get a free education.


Last I checked, NCAA has no trade system unlike the pros..... and most if not all athletes are not just playing for the love of the game like a lot of Rec Leagues. Coaches in College sure as he!! aint coaching like its a rec-league game. They're coaching for their living. And if players were just playing for the love of the game..... then NIL wouldn't be a thing & this free agency transfer portal issue wouldn't be as big of a deal as it is.

So I'm sorry, but the comparisons between College & other levels of sports are just not there.

College Athletics is it's own unique world..... it's the only level of sports where an athlete can get treated as a kid & a grown adult at the same time.

 

[VCU Heel]

An appeal seems redundant - presenting the same information to the same organization. Is there a higher body within the NCAA? Will anything change in the next month? Probably not. Apparently, the situation did not meet the criteria. He will either use his 4th year of eligibility this year or next. Not a big deal either way. 4 schools in 4 years would be saying there are no transfer rules. Fine, dissolve all the transfer rules, it’s an illusion anyway. But until then, hold the line.

Joe should still have 2 years of eligibility left after sitting out a year. He still gets a fifth year of eligibility because of the COVID season and has six years to pay 5 seasons.

The twist is that if he graduates from VCU this year while sitting out, then he can transfer to a fifth school in 5 years and would not have to sit out because he would be a graduate transfer and the multi-transfer rule does not apply to graduate transfers.

He has several options:
1. Decide he doesn’t want to sit out a year and leave VCU now to play pro basketball.
2. Sit out a year at VCU and play 1-2 more seasons here.
3. Sit out a year at VCU, graduate, and transfer somewhere else to play 1-2 seasons.
4. Sit out a year at VCU, play 1 season at VCU, and then transfer out to another school as a graduate transfer for 1 season.

 

[artRAMinMN]

There's what's best for any given player in the here and now, and there's what's best for all players as a whole going forward in the future, IF they want to participate in what we think of as college basketball. Unfettered season-to-season player free agency via transfer would eventually destroy that. In the short term meantime some players can use it to their advantage, but once the institution collapses, that goes away, and it's uncertain what exactly would replace it... something even more exploitative and/or just less rewarding is very possible (think old minor league baseball).

Professional major leagues have salary caps and other mandates to promote franchise health and competitiveness across the enterprise, to better the over-all product. Players unions have collective bargaining agreements to similarly protect the entire body of talent from the worst excesses of exploitation.

If the consensus is that college basketball (college revenue sports generally) is something worthy of preserving, then its short-term operation shouldn't be run in a way that eventually destroys it. Limiting player freedom of movement arguably works to help maintain medium-term stability, but there's enough inherent unfairness possible in the results to also cause longer term weakness (talent opts out to go elsewhere). Coaches move and abandon players. Coaches push out and recruit over players. Much transfer traffic is coach-driven. If players had compensation and protection (such as multi-year scholarship contracts), it could help stability while improving fairness, and lessen the outsized impact that coaching turbulence tends to have. Multi-year contacts would also increase the responsibilities between players and institutions, and presumably the larger enterprise (the NCAA or whatever successor) would be able to institute protective floors and ceilings (e.g. salary cap) to regulate against runaway excesses.