The Beat The Orangemen of Syracuse in the Bahamas Thread

BradRamFan

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While I don't agree with CelticGuy much, I do agree with at least part of his statement that the board fans seem to be all up in arms about. Last night was the first game this season that I have seen us play a more inside-out game. And while driving my be considered inside-out, I am talking more of a traditional inside-out to our big men in the low post. Plus when we drove, we actively looked to kick it back out or pass it off if we didn't have a good shot.
In previous games, we have been shooting the 3 and driving into the lane for the shot without looking to kick it out. This is what I call a two pronged attack. Plus, we had our big men playing like guards out on the perimeter most of the time. I don't know if it was just Cuse who gave us more of a traditional inside-out opportunity but adding this third dimension/3 pronged attack plus a willingness to kick out or pass to the open man inside certain helped us last night. We need this 3 pronged attack to continue.
Whether it has been coached or not, I won't say as I have no knowledge. But I certainly think it would be as Rhoades has stated multiple seasons that he wants a more inside out game. Nonetheless, I thought we played a complete offensive game last night - shooting from 3, driving the lane, utilizing our big men down low, and also looking for the outlet pass when needed.
With all that said, I don't think we would have won this game had it not been for the way we played defense yesterday. Sports pundits call it ugly. I think it was a thing of beauty. Cuse had to fight - and fight hard for just about every shot they took and every pass they made, every rebound they attempted to get and every ball they dribbled
 

Love2Ram

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Not sure what's going on with Hason Ward, but 6 points and 4 rebounds isn't cutting it. He's starting to remind me of Juvonte Reddic's senior year. Lots of hype/potential, but just isn't delivering. I'm not seeing a whole lot of energy out of Ward right now, which concerns me. He has gone from just under 30.67 mpg the first 3 games to 23.5 mpg in VCU's last two games, and he hasn't even been close to any foul trouble. His rebounding has also dropped significantly the last two games.​
Nothing official but I think Ward is getting over something. I saw him spitting up in the trash during a timeout while everyone was huddled. Facial expressions seemed to confirm he wasn't 100% during conversations with coaches. Could be the water here but I had a good view right behind the bench.
 

Wolfpack Ram

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Nothing official but I think Ward is getting over something. I saw him spitting up in the trash during a timeout while everyone was huddled. Facial expressions seemed to confirm he wasn't 100% during conversations with coaches. Could be the water here but I had a good view right behind the bench.

He looked the same way against Chattanooga, so it's not the water. Whatever it is, he took it with him to the Bahamas. Coach Rhoades even took him out of the game down the stretch against Chattanooga.
 

Violet Ram

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He looked the same way against Chattanooga, so it's not the water. Whatever it is, he took it with him to the Bahamas. Coach Rhoades even took him out of the game down the stretch against Chattanooga.
I hate speculating about people's health, but I wonder if any of our players are experiencing long COVID symptoms.
 

LLLeopold

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Elite 8 run??

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The fur Elite 8 run is more commonly known as the NIT quarterfinals
 

duncanlamb

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I hate speculating about people's health, but I wonder if any of our players are experiencing long COVID symptoms.
I doubt it.

Either way, we need jimmy nichols to show up as another shot blocker with Hason at 80%.
 

rammad90

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What games have you been watching? Players have been coached from day one to play inside out. In other words, to get paint touches. That doesn’t always mean throwing an entry pass to a big at the block. It can mean drive and kick, for example. They’ve been trying to go inside out, but haven’t been very good at it. That’s been the problem. Heck, we weren’t very good doing it in the first half against Syracuse either. As guys get game experience playing with each other, they’ll improve. Also, the other team tries to win, too. They have coaches who watch video and scout, just like we do.

I posted on here before the season that we may lose some games to teams that make people scratch their heads. Had two of those already. There may be more. I also mentioned that we’d improve and be much better by Christmas, and hopefully much, much better by March.

Our offensive flow was better against Vandy than it had been in games 1 and 2, even though it didn’t show in points scored. Our flow and shooting was better against Chattanooga than it was against Vandy, but it didn’t result in a win because we are very much a work in progress (way too many turnovers and missed FTs in that Chattanooga game). Against Syracuse, the 2nd half was beautiful. We played inside out, made shots, and only turned the ball over 4 times. That’s called improvement. It’s when players carry over what they’ve been taught and what they practice every stinking day to the game.
HBK as you state we agree more than we disagree. However, Celtic is correct and as I remember you and I debated this last week or so after the UTC game. Remember you stated that Stockard minutes should be cut. I disagreed and stated we merely needed to get him the ball in the post when he was working hard and he was working his butt of against UTC but he didnt get the ball. Even Ed Nixon mentioned this during his evaluation fo the game.

Our offense has a better flow because we have gone inside out with Levi. The other big guys arent really back to the basket players so it doesnt work with them on the floor but Levi can get it done.

Ed Nixon suggested that its not coaching as much as it might be guys unfamiliar or afraid of making those passes because they are afraid of turnovers. Celtic is wrong is stating that we "all of sudden" decide to play inside out. I think it is more an evolution of young guys getting comfortable. We do start two freshman at guard.

So at the end of the day you both are correct. It is improvement but it also was something that was needed, and Levi was never the issue. He was the solution.

Additionally, I'd like to see the two bigs mainly Stockard continue to work on passing to each other in the paint. Levi is bulky and strong enough to draw doubles or get to the hoop for easy baskets on most of our opponents not named UR, Bonnies, or Dayton. Keep doing what they did this week and we will be good.
 
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HBK

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HBK as you state we agree more than we disagree. However, Celtic is correct and as I remember you and I debated this last week or so after the UTC game. Remember you stated that Stockard minutes should be cut. I disagreed and stated we merely needed to get him the ball in the post when he was working hard and he was working his butt of against UTC but he didnt get the ball. Even Ed Nixon mentioned this during his evaluation fo the game.

Our offense has a better flow because we have gone inside out with Levi. The other big guys arent really back to the basket players so it doesnt work with them on the floor but Levi can get it done.

Ed Nixon suggested that its not coaching as much as it might be guys unfamiliar or afraid of making those passes because they are afraid of turnovers. Celtic is wrong is stating that we "all of sudden" decide to play inside out. I think it is more an evolution of young guys getting comfortable. We do start two freshman at guard.

So at the end of the day you both are correct. It is improvement but it also was something that was needed, and Levi was never the issue. He was the solution.

Additionally, I'd like to see the two bigs mainly Stockard continue to work on passing to each other in the paint. Levi is bulky and strong enough to draw doubles or get to the hoop for easy baskets on most of our opponents not named UR, Bonnies, or Dayton. Keep doing what they did this week and we will be good.
Respectfully, you have me confused with someone else. I never said Stockard's minutes should be cut. He is our only true and consistent low post threat on offense. What I said was that he was bullied by Chattanooga and for all of his skills, he is not a great rebounder. I cited that both MBJ and DeLoach have almost as many rebounds in much less court time than Stockard. I also said that if he doesn't get the ball on the offensive end early in each half, he can become a non-factor. He is not unique in that respect. Many bigs need some touches to help stay engaged. Perhaps his getting bullied by Chattanooga was a function of his frustration at not getting the ball.

I totally agree with Ed that it's not coaching. Again, I've been consistent since preseason: we have a lot of guys in new roles, so it will time for guys to learn to play together. We also don't have a lot of guys who can make good post entry passes, though they did a much better job in the Bahamas than they did in the four games pre-Atlantis. That's just another example of improvement. The games in Atlantis were, in my opinion, the best Stockard has played at VCU.
 
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We also don't have a lot of guys who can make good post entry passes, though they did a much better job in the Bahamas than they did in the four games pre-Atlantis.
entry passes to post are a combination of factors -
1. MR needs to create angles for entry passes in their offensive pattern/scheme
2. Bigs need to be able to seal defender on one side of their hip or the other and give passer a great target
3. Passer needs to get ball to the correct side of post man and at a height that post player can receive without losing position he established (low passes at shin to Stockard or Ward are not good passes as an example)

Post players need to receive and make move not take too much time to allow defense recovery
Lastly post players need to recognize where double is coming from and keep ball HOT if necessary

go rams
 
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All of the other teams we have played used different matchup zones. Syracuse plays a straight up 2-3 zone. It’s a much more passive zone and their players aren’t as athletic as those that Chattanooga and Wagner had out there.

All zones aren’t built the same and they have to be attacked in different ways. Syracuse’s zone was the worst one we’ve played this year, particularly when their one and only true big man was out.
but as you no doubt saw, they continued to include him in the other two games. wehampered him by running other guys through the paint thereby clogging it up but hopefully the kids will realize that they need to stay outside until after the pass goes into him.
 
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