The Official Beat the Kennesaw State Owls at the Stu Thread

[mrgeode]

Speaking of cherry picking, you isolated Evans injury in our sole NCAAT appearance to absolve Mike's coaching style and tactics causing us to miss 3 other tournaments.

How does that make any sense?

I don't think it makes sense to say Mike's coaching style or tactics caused us to miss the tournament last year. Or his first year, for that matter - those both seem much more Jimmies and Joes than X's and O's.

I guess it's a matter of perspective. I'm always disappointed to not make it to the NCAAs, but I wasn't surprised not to make it given what we knew going into his first year or last year. Honestly last year was surprising because Ace came back so quickly and at such a high level, and we got so close to making it even with no margin for error after how the season started. 19-20 was a failure regardless of the tournament being cancelled, and I think not making it this year would be as well. We're a long way off from that right now though.

 

[Mr X]

I don't think it makes sense to say Mike's coaching style or tactics caused us to miss the tournament last year. Or his first year, for that matter - those both seem much more Jimmies and Joes than X's and O's.

I guess it's a matter of perspective. I'm always disappointed to not make it to the NCAAs, but I wasn't surprised not to make it given what we knew going into his first year or last year. Honestly last year was surprising because Ace came back so quickly and at such a high level, and we got so close to making it even with no margin for error after how the season started. 19-20 was a failure regardless of the tournament being cancelled, and I think not making it this year would be as well. We're a long way off from that right now though.

Right. We have the talent, but can we get the most of that talent this year? If not, disapointment.

 

[RamDanFan]

Well considering I'm not some player or only cares about one thing in a relationship... I enjoy the early stages of a relationship just as much as I do hitting a home run. You know why? Because you can't score a home run if you can't get to first base first.

If all I cared about was hitting a homerun.... I could go find someone looking for the same thing... hit the home run & then ditch them. But that's NOT my game. If that's your game... have fun with it. That's your priority, not mine. I think long term, not short term.

Just like when I played sports... I'm not trying to be someone I'm not. If I hit a home run, I hit a home run.... but my goal is to help my team win first. No matter what sport I'm playing. I could give a f**k less about being the star player, the Michael Jordan, Tom Brady or Barry Bonds on the field or the court.

Also, you didn't answer the question I asked. Home run was not an option in my question & neither was making an occasional 3 pointer. Maybe you have trouble reading... or maybe you just make up your own rules as you go along.

And if that's the case, I'm sure your relationships go swell... just don't be mad when the person you're dating is tired of playing your games or you making up the rules as you go along... and you end up striking out.

I asked you what you enjoyed more, not what you cared about more. So I guess that makes 2 of us that have trouble reading. Lol.

18 years and counting so I guess I must be more lucky than she is tired of games and rules.

 

[theyaintwantit]

Primarily that reason has been our team not being good enough to get invited 3 of his 5 seasons here

For what it’s worth, the NCAA has only invited teams to the tournament in 2 of his 4 seasons 😉

 

[DNB]

Bri's different. It wasn't his team leading QB prowess that we missed. Treveon Captained that ship and we had others who could fill in, some even a better fit, on O.

The difference with Bri was his game changing D. Plus wasnt Treveon hurt during that period as well?

High Ankle Sprain.

 

[theyaintwantit]

High Ankle Sprain.

Courtesy of the Rhode Island Rams coached by Danny Hurley. They did it on purpose.

 

[2012Ram]

I’ve been clear. Go back and look at several posts from the past couple of days. Mike likes to give players a lot of freedom on offense. I think that freedom needs to be earned, and I‘m not sure we’ve earned it. Thus, I’d like to see him reel in some of that freedom on offense and run a few more set plays.

Most importantly, while I’ve been clear that his first season went about as I expected (a major struggle), so I can give him a pass for it, I don’t give him a pass for year three, the 2019-2020 season. That was an epic collapse and blame is deserved all around. However, if a major factor was ”chemistry issues”, as has been suggested by many, then that is primarily on the coaches. When you have an experienced team coming back and you collapse like that, then the staff should get the bulk of the blame. So, what I consider to be the one truly bad season Mike has had at VCU, especially relative to my own expectations, then the blame for it falls squarely on the shoulders of Mike and his staff because whatever they did wasn’t working.

Mike and staff deserve blame for missing on the transfers last season. You never really know how it’s going to workout, but Tsohonis and Nichols proved to be busts. Too early to tell with this season‘s transfers, but as a group they’ve already been more effective than last season’s duo.

If don’t believe nuance and context are important throughout life, then that’s on you. One day, I suspect you’ll realize how important they are, just as you’ll realize that reasons and excuses are two entirely different things.

Thread after thread after thread features you in it, explaining how it really wasn't mikes fault this, that, and how he gets a pass for this and that, and how he deserves credit for a comeback win against an ASUN bottomfeeder, and how if the offense is getting worse every single year for 6 years it's not his fault because the player aren't listening to his brilliant offensive scheme - and even if he recruited them it's not on him still.

I just think you should know that that is absolutely not nuance or context - it is making excuses due to bias. You can call it something other than that if you want, and attempt to condescend to people when they call it out for the bullpoop it is if you want, just know that nobody's buying it but you.

The obsessive apologism from you for Rhoades is as tiresome as the people that blame Rhoades if one of the mop boys misses a spot. I understand that you really really really really really really really like Mike, but it has influenced your ability to accurately assess his tenure here, even if you won't admit it.

 

[DNB]

I asked you what you enjoyed more, not what you cared about more. So I guess that makes 2 of us that have trouble reading. Lol.

18 years and counting so I guess I must be more lucky than she is tired of games and rules.

And welcome to the dating game brought to you by Rem Nation

 

[HBK]

Thread after thread after thread features you in it, explaining how it really wasn't mikes fault this, that, and how he gets a pass for this and that, and how he deserves credit for a comeback win against an ASUN bottomfeeder, and how if the offense is getting worse every single year for 6 years it's not his fault because the player aren't listening to his brilliant offensive scheme - and even if he recruited them it's not on him still.

I just think you should know that that is absolutely not nuance or context - it is making excuses due to bias. You can call it something other than that if you want, and attempt to condescend to people when they call it out for the bullpoop it is if you want, just know that nobody's buying it but you.

The obsessive apologism from you for Rhoades is as tiresome as the people that blame Rhoades if one of the mop boys misses a spot. I understand that you really really really really really really really like Mike, but it has influenced your ability to accurately assess his tenure here, even if you won't admit it.

Opinions vary, Sparky.

I just gave you examples of blame I place squarely on Mike’s shoulders, including a horrible collapse in 2020, per your question. Otherwise, your recent post above is mostly crap with you just putting words into my mouth, which is the purview of several others on this fan forum. I’m frankly tired of folks who refuse to actually read and comprehend statements, so they take it upon themselves to put their spin on it. That’s where I draw the line. Not going to play the game anymore with people who just make stuff up.

Good luck and happy holidays.

 

[MobileMunchies]

Courtesy of the Rhode Island Rams coached by Danny Hurley. They did it on purpose.

It was a loose ball Tre was about 1.5 seconds in front of anyone else to dive in the far right corner of the court and grab, and one of them rather sloppily landed on his ankle diving after him diving for it if I recall correctly. They weren't diving for the ball, they were trying to tackle Tre.

 

[RamDanFan]

Knowing Pkunk for over 15 years he focuses more on learning about the person/creating a solid connection than scoring tbh. Might be the wrong person to ask that.

I know who he is and would expect that from him. But the question was about what he enjoyed more, not focused more. It was a way to give him back a question with no ideal answer as a choice in such a manner as he did with me.

 

[2012Ram]

Opinions vary, Sparky.

I just gave you examples of blame I place squarely on Mike’s shoulders, including a horrible collapse in 2020, per your question. Otherwise, your recent post above is mostly crap with you just putting words into my mouth, which is the purview of several others on this fan forum. I’m frankly tired of folks who refuse to actually read and comprehend statements, so they take it upon themselves to put their spin on it. That’s where I draw the line. Not going to play the game anymore with people who just make stuff up.

Good luck and happy holidays.

Opinions vary, but facts don't. We're in year 6 of the Mike Rhoades experiment and we're 0-1 in the NCAAT - and if this year's team doesn't shape up dramatically and get drastically better, fast, we'll miss the tournament again.

That is not good, objectively, no matter how many "nuanced context reasons" you spit out as to why he's not to blame.

You can draw the line wherever you like, and not "play the game" or whatever that means too - but you probably won't need to in the first place if you reexamine your bias a bit and get a little bit more objective.

 

[Violet Ram]

Opinions vary, but facts don't. We're in year 6 of the Mike Rhoades experiment and we're 0-1 in the NCAAT - and if this year's team doesn't shape up dramatically and get drastically better, fast, we'll miss the tournament again.

That is not good, objectively, no matter how many "nuanced context reasons" you spit out as to why he's not to blame.

You can draw the line wherever you like, and not "play the game" or whatever that means too - but you probably won't need to in the first place if you reexamine your bias a bit and get a little bit more objective.

Im not sure if I would get hung up on the 0-1 NCAA record given the circumstances, but at the same time, 2020 was a disappointment even if we didn't "miss" the tournament and last year. Those are the marks that weigh more to me.

I'm not going to go back and find your post about offense being wretched. I don't disagree, but 2 things. I blame a portion of it on coaching and the other portion on recruiting. When ace is out, we dont have another player whose actually a PG. That's a recruiting failure and Rhoades has had the same issues for half of his tenure here.

Second, just want to note that we didn't have great offenses with Shaka. A lot of the fun and points came from pressing. Our offense back then involved a lot of perimeter weaves in the half court. Wades teams were more efficient in the half court but also kinda boring.

 

[mrgeode]

Im not sure if I would get hung up on the 0-1 NCAA record given the circumstances, but at the same time, 2020 was a disappointment even if we didn't "miss" the tournament and last year. Those are the marks that weigh more to me.

I'm not going to go back and find your post about offense being wretched. I don't disagree, but 2 things. I blame a portion of it on coaching and the other portion on recruiting. When ace is out, we dont have another player whose actually a PG. That's a recruiting failure and Rhoades has had the same issues for half of his tenure here.

Second, just want to note that we didn't have great offenses with Shaka. A lot of the fun and points came from pressing. Our offense back then involved a lot of perimeter weaves in the half court. Wades teams were more efficient in the half court but also kinda boring.

The biggest issue for us last year, and so far this year, are just all the friggin turnovers. Some are probably attributable to coaching, some are on guys not catching the ball, shuffling their feet, stepping out of bounds (my God, KeShawn last year), or throwing uncatchable passes. If we can cut them by even a quarter it would make a huge difference. By half might even mean a top 150 offense, which should be more than enough to win most games we play.

 

[2012Ram]

Im not sure if I would get hung up on the 0-1 NCAA record given the circumstances, but at the same time, 2020 was a disappointment even if we didn't "miss" the tournament and last year. Those are the marks that weigh more to me.

I'm not going to go back and find your post about offense being wretched. I don't disagree, but 2 things. I blame a portion of it on coaching and the other portion on recruiting. When ace is out, we dont have another player whose actually a PG. That's a recruiting failure and Rhoades has had the same issues for half of his tenure here.

Second, just want to note that we didn't have great offenses with Shaka. A lot of the fun and points came from pressing. Our offense back then involved a lot of perimeter weaves in the half court. Wades teams were more efficient in the half court but also kinda boring.

Our offense has been wretched for years, though. It's always been ugly, with 0 flow, 0 coordination, tons of turnovers, and tons of forcing from our players. It just doesn't really work well. The numbers bear that out - Mike has had 1 offense in the top 33% of CBB - his first year. The season's young, but the data so far points to this year's team being the worst offensive VCU team kenpom has ever recorded. In year friggin 6' of Mike Rhoades with all his guys a few times over.

The eye test proves it a million times over too. I wouldn't be in the least bit surprised to learn that a major reason for our drop in attendance isn't just covid or ticket prices but the fact that our style of basketball is really, really hard to watch - which would be fine if we won the games needed to get bids (cough cough UVA).

Whether we run a terrible scheme (this is my primary guess), we recruit players that don't fit that scheme (maybe some of this too), or we don't change the scheme to fit the players we have (definitely some of this) - I don't know who else's feet to lay the blame at than the staff's. It's not Marcus Evans' ankles fault that we've been bad at offense for 6 years.