Players Time to have a conversation

deadpoet

Top Member
Feb 11, 2010
259
620
I shared the post about troy here(sharing his life experiences with racism) and didn't see any response.
Also shared in a facebook fan group which i no longer admin.
He mentioned three words within a sentence, "black lives matter".
It faced fierce fire from some of our "fans" there, and got deleted, twice, and I kept putting it in, putting my two cents even firmer each time, finally figured it would face the same challenge to white privilege it faces elsewhere, and the same with the pic above, and the hoops shooting at marcus-david peters circle. All faced what I can only attribute to white privilege being threatened. That's what we're seeing these days. Those three words threaten white superiority in and of themselves. As does white and black people being shoulder to shoulder standing against racism.
I'm glad to live to see the day when racism has it's day in the court of public opinion. Seeing white privilege get outed is something we've all needed to see. We should all spend some time paying our condolences and put that sht in a grave.
It's also a good time to spend time looking inside ourselves (actually past time) and do a little internal diagnosis of what you find, be honest with yourself, some things are rotten, toxic, and don't belong in there. Get rid of them before they hurt other people if not for the sole reason of keeping it from hurting you along the way. It;s gonna eventually destroy you (as we're seeing some do to themselves simply looking at a pic of our guys together on that monument above) That's exactly what it's destined to do, no matter how you were taught or how you were raised, or what you think your good book was subjectively interpreted to tell you, that crap doesn't belong in the heart and soul of a good person. And if you insist on being a bad person, nobody has any more time for your sht, it's done enough damage already, .. please stay teh fck away from me, you know darn welll taking one look at me I won't tolerate it, and stay out of the way, there's a tidal wave going on which will not stop any time soon, and you're gonna get swept away out to sea, and nobody is swimming out there to get your ass when it does.
So if someone disagrees with you and cites facts or asks for specific examples of your feelings, emotions and platitudes that is white privilege? When I was much younger I was pulled out of a vehicle and wrongly arrested for larceny. My car was surrounded by state trooper cruisers and plainclothes cop cars. Their guns weren't drawn but their jackets were pulled back displaying their weapons. If I were black could I use this as an example of racism toward me? If not, why not? If so, why? When I was a student at VCU I lived for a while with my grandma in her farm house that had no heat. I had to wake up at 4:30 am to start drawing water for my bath(no shower) and wet wash cloths to place around the edge of the tub to keep the winter air from blowing in. I would wake up in the morning and in my bed blow smoke when I yawned. I can remember taking night exams and walking home from the campus to the far west end. My grandma gave me rubber bands and plastic bags to cover my shoes. I couldn't afford winter boots. Can you tell me which part of this true story is white privilege? You don't want an honest conversation about anything. You want to talk about microaggressions, systemic racism (whatever that means) and other nonsense. Growing up in the deep south in the 60s I've seen racism and I have experienced real overt racism and I am white. I remember as a kid with my father driving by a lounge in rural Georgia. The sign out front said "No crackers allowed." I asked my dad what was a cracker and he said "you're a cracker son." Oh the humanity. People treat other people poorly all over the world and sometimes it is because of their race. It has been occurring for centuries. We don't belong to "tribes." Every person is an individual and should be treated and judged as such. I have given thousands of dollars of my services to people of all races who cannot afford me. These are proud folks and every year my wife and I receive bags of sweet potatoes and other vegetables on our porch as anonymous payments for services rendered. I consider this the way people should treat each other...nothing more. Other than run your mouth what have you done for the human race? Feral cats don't count as part of the human race. I have a few questions in response to you threatening diatribe. Why do Nigerians do so well in our country of systemic racism? Why do Asians come here in unseaworthy boats without a cent in their pocket learn the language and achieve amongst all of this systemic racism? Why did three million people from Africa and the Caribbean move to our country in the last 20 years? Was it for opportunity or did they want to experience systemic racism? How does a Cuban immigrant get off the boat with nothing, take a job cleaning bathrooms in a restaurant and within a decade own their own restaurant amidst all of this systemic racism? Before you start calling me racist or bellowing white privilege I thought you might be proud to know I have decided no more thousands of dollars per year to the VCU athletic fund from me. I gave this years donation to the Bob Woodson 1776 project and will probably continue doing so in the future. One last comment. I assume you are down for the BLM movement. In other words you are down for an anti-Semitic Marxist organization. In Los Angeles the Black Lives Matter attacked Temple Beth El, Baba Sali Congregation, the Kosher Mensch Bakery and Kitchen, Cong. Beth Israel, Cong. Beth Tivereth Avi/Morasha, Shaarei Tefilah Synagogue, Shalhevet Yeshiva High School for Girls, and a Shul wall on which were spray-painted anti-Semitic and anti-Israel slogans. They defaced a statue of Raoul Wallenberg, the Swedish diplomat who lost his life during the World War II era to save thousands of Hungarian Jews from being gassed and cremated by Hitler’s Nazis in Auschwitz. It is your right to support and speak in favor of a virulent hate group such as this. I support your right to support bigoted, racist organizations. I don't agree with you at all but I support your right to free speech and your freedom to associate with whatever hate group you like. One final note. After 50+ years you may not see my shadow at any future VCU games but you will not sweep me out to sea. Is this the conversation you were looking for?
 

Ramaholic

Top Member
Mar 8, 2010
835
2,896
I'm good with this topic sitting right here. The team made the decision together to take a stance, I support the team and the stance. Proud of these guys. GO RAMS!
This should be off topic because although it features the VCU team, this thread will go into a discussion that will more or less be an echo chamber for each persons view on a non VCU MBB topic. This will quickly morph into politics -an issue we should stay clear of on a fan board where we should come together and discuss VCU basketball -not argue over political stances. There will be arguing, chest thumping, virtue signaling and shaming attempts by people on all sides. In other words, there will be more hate. There are all sorts of places to have this discussion and all sorts of ways to make meaningful change. It's your forum. You all do a very good job with it and I enjoy it. I think this is a mistake to leave it here. Nobody is going to change their views. They are going to argue and hurt each other's feelings.

.
 
May 5, 2009
4,276
3,745
I agree Ramaholic, but I will add that I grew up in an Italian family. We were called Dagos, Wops, Guineas, Mafioso. It was ethnic racism. Any name that ended with a vowel. Google the Italian lynching in New Orleans. To me all lives matter. The Italian community was really upset the tearing down the Christopher Columbus statue by the ignorant mob.
 
  • Like
Reactions: VCUBeatsduke
Feb 20, 2009
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This should be off topic because although it features the VCU team, this thread will go into a discussion that will more or less be an echo chamber for each persons view on a non VCU MBB topic. This will quickly morph into politics -an issue we should stay clear of on a fan board where we should come together and discuss VCU basketball -not argue over political stances. There will be arguing, chest thumping, virtue signaling and shaming attempts by people on all sides. In other words, there will be more hate. There are all sorts of places to have this discussion and all sorts of ways to make meaningful change. It's your forum. You all do a very good job with it and I enjoy it. I think this is a mistake to leave it here. Nobody is going to change their views. They are going to argue and hurt each other's feelings.

.
This thread has been up for almost 24 hours and it has not "quickly morphed into politics".

If anything this thread has pretty much been dead and avoided by most.
 

TampaKAP

Insider
Apr 21, 2009
3,658
7,193
The inability to have a conversation is more problematic than any of the concerns. An unwillingness to accept that two things can be true leaves many void of the ability to find common ground from which to engage in meaningful dialogue. Human nature is not a series of absolutes like a mathematical equation. Unlike machines, humans are not coded with 0's and 1's processing repeated task. Human's are a reflection of there experiences and teachings. I have experienced acts of racism most of my life but at the same time, I am both socially and professionally successful. So again two things can be true. As a black man, do I think racism exist, Yes. As a black man was I able to be successful in America.

There are many VCU fans I have met over the years, some of which are on this board @deadpoet who I had the pleasure of purchasing tickets from once when I unexpectedly found myself in town for example. Nothing about our interaction led me to believe he was anything other than a good guy trying to do the best he could in this thing called life. Of his post there are two things that I would say.
  • by definition of the word tribe, we all do loosely belong to one or more tribes but that not have to define who we are
  • Again, two things can be true. You can believe and support the notation that black lives matter(I do) and at the same time not be a supporter of the BLM Organization(I don't)
Someone stated that this forum would just be an echo chamber as you would not change anyone's mind. I agree if people approach it from the point of standing on their side off the room and yelling across that the statement is accurate. What I would hope is that people would come to the middle and at least start a dialogue from a common point.
 
Last edited:

vcumad

Insider
Jan 19, 2010
39
57
I shared the post about troy here(sharing his life experiences with racism) and didn't see any response.
Also shared in a facebook fan group which i no longer admin.
He mentioned three words within a sentence, "black lives matter".
It faced fierce fire from some of our "fans" there, and got deleted, twice, and I kept putting it in, putting my two cents even firmer each time, finally figured it would face the same challenge to white privilege it faces elsewhere, and the same with the pic above, and the hoops shooting at marcus-david peters circle. All faced what I can only attribute to white privilege being threatened. That's what we're seeing these days. Those three words threaten white superiority in and of themselves. As does white and black people being shoulder to shoulder standing against racism.
I'm glad to live to see the day when racism has it's day in the court of public opinion. Seeing white privilege get outed is something we've all needed to see. We should all spend some time paying our condolences and put that sht in a grave.
It's also a good time to spend time looking inside ourselves (actually past time) and do a little internal diagnosis of what you find, be honest with yourself, some things are rotten, toxic, and don't belong in there. Get rid of them before they hurt other people if not for the sole reason of keeping it from hurting you along the way. It;s gonna eventually destroy you (as we're seeing some do to themselves simply looking at a pic of our guys together on that monument above) That's exactly what it's destined to do, no matter how you were taught or how you were raised, or what you think your good book was subjectively interpreted to tell you, that crap doesn't belong in the heart and soul of a good person. And if you insist on being a bad person, nobody has any more time for your sht, it's done enough damage already, .. please stay teh fck away from me, you know darn welll taking one look at me I won't tolerate it, and stay out of the way, there's a tidal wave going on which will not stop any time soon, and you're gonna get swept away out to sea, and nobody is swimming out there to get your ass when it does.
I couldn't agree with you more. I have been in this world for 67 years and the pace of addressing and actually taking steps to materially improve racial inequality has been pathetic.Lots of people talk about it, but little has been done about it....which is why many get upset now that some real progress has a chance to actually come to fruition. You are one of the kindest, thoughtful good-hearted person I have had the honor to call a friend and I hope you continue to promote the "peace & love" mentality that is much needed in this critical time of our nation's history. Your contributions/conversations are needed and appreciated....Preach!
 

TampaKAP

Insider
Apr 21, 2009
3,658
7,193
I agree Ramaholic, but I will add that I grew up in an Italian family. We were called Dagos, Wops, Guineas, Mafioso. It was ethnic racism. Any name that ended with a vowel. Google the Italian lynching in New Orleans. To me all lives matter. The Italian community was really upset the tearing down the Christopher Columbus statue by the ignorant mob.
I come in peace but I have a couple questions. First, let me say I took time to read up on the Italian lynching in New Orleans. I think its important to at least have some context if you intend to have a dialogue with a person. Definitely a horrific event in our nations history and honestly one I was not aware of or remember from any history class

I agree that All Lives Matter but I am not sure why some people, and I am not saying this is what you did, have to use that as the rebuttal to black lives matter. Two things can be true. I think we can agree that All Cancer is bad but when people wear a ribbon or highlight say Breast Cancer, I have seen a rash of people saying Lung Cancer matters or colon cancer matter etc. (Let me be very clear. There is a difference between the idea of BLM which I support and the BLM Movement which I don't support)

MY second question is from a desire for education. As best as I know, Columbus never set foot on any land that is a part of North America and more specifically the current day USA. so regardless of ones view of him, why is he worthy of a National holiday in the USA? This question is not to pick a fight but to tryto atleast get a view from a person of Italian decent
 

Natty

Co-Founder
Top Member
Insider
Feb 12, 2009
5,801
13,924
Every time I've come across an extremely complicated issue the past decade I think back to my pre-marriage counseling in 2010 I was required to do to get my pastor friend (Brandon Baldwin, great guy) to officiate my wedding. Long story short, the big takeaway/lesson for me was how to have a conversation in a real and lasting relationship. It's how you listen (do you listen to listen or listen to respond?), how you respond (..."so you are saying that you feel ______ because ______....I feel...etc etc) and how to work through challenging times to make something work/last, assuming you want to make it work at all.

It's my observation that we have essentially a "failed relationship" in a huge chunk of America because we aren't really acting as a married couple in either terms of politics or race because it's currently easy not to, we can just retreat into our tribe. Is this a relationship worth fighting for or one doomed by unreconcilable differences? There are most definitely people all over the spectrum who will fight toward the later, but I personally think it's worth fighting for.

@vadiplomat04, I hear what you're saying and I'm listening. If you ever feel you've witnessed/experienced racism on this board, please DM me and I'll take a look at it and if a post or even someone has to go, as a moderator (and 1/4th owner of this forum), that's something I have the ability to directly address. There will likely be times where I 100% agree with you (I think the term "thug" gets thrown around way too much in a seriously coded way) and perhaps times where I don't (for example, I don't think people are mad about people transferring because of some desire to be slave owners -- I've seen all races be pissed about transfers -- I think it's more like when your girlfriend breaks up with you and you're pissed at both her and the new guy).

Going back to the marriage relationship example, if people expect the only way to have relationship is to always agree, well I have some news for anyone who isn't/hasn't been married. I've been very happily married for 10 years now, not because my wife and I are lockstep on every single thing, but because we have 1) a true desire to make it work and 2) can effectively communicate.

Let's make this work.
 

deadpoet

Top Member
Feb 11, 2010
259
620
The inability to have a conversation is more problematic than any of the concerns. An unwillingness to accept that two things can be true leaves many void of the ability to find common ground from which to engage in meaningful dialogue. Human nature is not a series of absolutes like a mathematical equation. Unlike machines, humans are not coded with 0's and 1's processing repeated task. Human's are a reflection of there experiences and teachings. I have experienced acts of racism most of my life but at the same time, I am both socially and professionally successful. So again two things can be true. As a black man, do I think racism exist, Yes. As a black man was I able to be successful in America.

There are many VCU fans I have met over the years, some of which are on this board @deadpoet who I had the pleasure of purchasing tickets from once when I unexpectedly found myself in town for example. Nothing about our interaction led me to believe he was anything other than a good guy trying to do the best he could in this thing called life. Of his post there are two things that I would say.
  • by definition of the word tribe, we all do loosely belong to one or more tribes but that not have to define who we are
  • Again, two things can be true. You can believe and support the notation that black lives matter(I do) and at the same time not be a supporter of the BLM Organization(I don't)
Someone stated that this forum would just be an echo chamber as you would not change anyone's mind. I agree if people approach it from the point of standing on their side off the room and yelling across that the statement is accurate. What I would hope is that people would come to the middle and at least start a dialogue from a common point.
Excellent post TampaKAP. My tribe is my family.
 

BaNgMyPrOgRaM

Top Member
Insider
Mar 27, 2009
19,142
10,716
No one is answering my original question. So I guess this thread is about one's diatribes and not conversations?
 

rvaram

Top Member
Mar 26, 2012
3,199
5,049

I thought this was a good/interesting read. So far, at least in the public sphere, it's been hard to have much of a conversation on the matter at hand.
 

TampaKAP

Insider
Apr 21, 2009
3,658
7,193
No one is answering my original question. So I guess this thread is about one's diatribes and not conversations?
Probably the best person to answer is the person who made the quotes. What I can say that we all should be able to relate to is that everyone riding in the same car may not see the same thing. So just because two people don't see the same thing doesn't make on right or one wrong. I can't speak to what the person you quoted saw and likewise I can't say if you are missing something but I can only reiterate that people on can be in the same plane, train, bus etc and see different things based on where they sit
 

vcumad

Insider
Jan 19, 2010
39
57
So if someone disagrees with you and cites facts or asks for specific examples of your feelings, emotions and platitudes that is white privilege? When I was much younger I was pulled out of a vehicle and wrongly arrested for larceny. My car was surrounded by state trooper cruisers and plainclothes cop cars. Their guns weren't drawn but their jackets were pulled back displaying their weapons. If I were black could I use this as an example of racism toward me? If not, why not? If so, why? When I was a student at VCU I lived for a while with my grandma in her farm house that had no heat. I had to wake up at 4:30 am to start drawing water for my bath(no shower) and wet wash cloths to place around the edge of the tub to keep the winter air from blowing in. I would wake up in the morning and in my bed blow smoke when I yawned. I can remember taking night exams and walking home from the campus to the far west end. My grandma gave me rubber bands and plastic bags to cover my shoes. I couldn't afford winter boots. Can you tell me which part of this true story is white privilege? You don't want an honest conversation about anything. You want to talk about microaggressions, systemic racism (whatever that means) and other nonsense. Growing up in the deep south in the 60s I've seen racism and I have experienced real overt racism and I am white. I remember as a kid with my father driving by a lounge in rural Georgia. The sign out front said "No crackers allowed." I asked my dad what was a cracker and he said "you're a cracker son." Oh the humanity. People treat other people poorly all over the world and sometimes it is because of their race. It has been occurring for centuries. We don't belong to "tribes." Every person is an individual and should be treated and judged as such. I have given thousands of dollars of my services to people of all races who cannot afford me. These are proud folks and every year my wife and I receive bags of sweet potatoes and other vegetables on our porch as anonymous payments for services rendered. I consider this the way people should treat each other...nothing more. Other than run your mouth what have you done for the human race? Feral cats don't count as part of the human race. I have a few questions in response to you threatening diatribe. Why do Nigerians do so well in our country of systemic racism? Why do Asians come here in unseaworthy boats without a cent in their pocket learn the language and achieve amongst all of this systemic racism? Why did three million people from Africa and the Caribbean move to our country in the last 20 years? Was it for opportunity or did they want to experience systemic racism? How does a Cuban immigrant get off the boat with nothing, take a job cleaning bathrooms in a restaurant and within a decade own their own restaurant amidst all of this systemic racism? Before you start calling me racist or bellowing white privilege I thought you might be proud to know I have decided no more thousands of dollars per year to the VCU athletic fund from me. I gave this years donation to the Bob Woodson 1776 project and will probably continue doing so in the future. One last comment. I assume you are down for the BLM movement. In other words you are down for an anti-Semitic Marxist organization. In Los Angeles the Black Lives Matter attacked Temple Beth El, Baba Sali Congregation, the Kosher Mensch Bakery and Kitchen, Cong. Beth Israel, Cong. Beth Tivereth Avi/Morasha, Shaarei Tefilah Synagogue, Shalhevet Yeshiva High School for Girls, and a Shul wall on which were spray-painted anti-Semitic and anti-Israel slogans. They defaced a statue of Raoul Wallenberg, the Swedish diplomat who lost his life during the World War II era to save thousands of Hungarian Jews from being gassed and cremated by Hitler’s Nazis in Auschwitz. It is your right to support and speak in favor of a virulent hate group such as this. I support your right to support bigoted, racist organizations. I don't agree with you at all but I support your right to free speech and your freedom to associate with whatever hate group you like. One final note. After 50+ years you may not see my shadow at any future VCU games but you will not sweep me out to sea. Is this the conversation you were looking for?
Wow... How long have you been waiting to get that off your chest? Hope you feel better. First, and most important, Mobile Munchies does not need me or anyone else to defend his comments....that's between him and you. But I would like to respond to a few of your comments. You also have the right to support whatever judgmental mumbo-jumbo assumptions you made in your post. I for one did not see anything in his post that indicated that only African Americans have had to deal with prejudice, nor did I see any comment about immigrants ability to come to this country and create a successful lives for themselves. As a previous poster indicated, you can support the idea that black lives matter without supporting the actions of the BLM organization. Just because someone supports the elimination of systemic racism doesn't mean there are no other problems that exist in this country nor does it mean they hate their country, they hate the police or that they are unpatriotic. It actually means they love their country and to want to make it a better place for all Americans. As for what has MM done for the human race...he (and Kat) have done everything in their power to make the little corner of the world they live in a better place and anyone that knows them can give you as many examples as you care to listen to. Why not take a peep in the mirror and ask yourself the same question.