Recruiting 2010
- Thread starter vcu70
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GMU went to the Final Four. I do not think that they have signed a single player that they would not have had a chance to sign if they didn't go to that Final Four. What have they accomplished since then? That whole situation is seriously shocking to me!
mrA10
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I don't think a single game is going to sign any recruits.
Maynors success and Sanders' potential NBA career ($$$) will certainly make an impression on potential recruits. What happened to the guys from that GMU final four team? (Absolutely no disrespect intended here. I think that GMU run was the best thing that has ever happened to the CAA.)
Maynors success and Sanders' potential NBA career ($$$) will certainly make an impression on potential recruits. What happened to the guys from that GMU final four team? (Absolutely no disrespect intended here. I think that GMU run was the best thing that has ever happened to the CAA.)
districtballer
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VCU4LIFE said:
I think you do have a point. If VCU ever went to the Final Four I would expect to be in contention for and getting a whole different level of recruit from the rest of the CAA. Mason has been very good but not anything substantially different from what the rest of the CAA is bringing in. VCU and Mason are often in the lists of the same recruits time after time after time.
I think sustained success is what really is key in recruiting. Mason had a HUGE Final Four run, but they haven't really done anything relevant relative to 2006. They went to the NCAA's again when we flopped against the Tribe in 08 but got destroyed by Notre Dame in the first round. VCU has been at the top since 2006 in large part due to Eric Maynor. We had a first-round win against Duke and a 1-point loss to UCLA last year. Then Eric went in the first round to the Jazz. Our success is not nearly as impressive as Mason's run, but the consistent success resonates with recruits and keeps them from thinking we are a one-hit wonder. Not saying Mason is, but that may be why they aren't pulling away from the rest of the conference with the level of recruit they are bringing in. I would argue they helped raise the level of recruiting across the board in the CAA.
But since you brought it up...let's see how the recruit rankings for Mason changed (if at all), pre and post-2006:
National rankings as per Hoopscooponline:
POST-FINAL FOUR:
2010: Jonathan Arledge (179)
2009: Johnnie Williams (129), Sherrod Weight (146), Vertrail Vaughns (194), Rashad Whack (257), Paris Bennett (283), Luke Hancock (#66 5th year prep player)
2008: Ryan Pearson (105), Andre Cornelius (118), Kevin Foster (232), Michael Morrison (287)
2007: Vlad Moldoveanu (213), Isaiah Tate (266), Cam Long (279)
PRE-FINAL FOUR:
2006: Dre Smith and Darryl Monroe were both JUCO's. Dre was a JUCO All-American who signed on after the Final Four run.
2005: Sammy Hernandez (211), Chris Fleming (263)
2004: Will Thomas (153), Folarin Campbell (225), Jordan Carter (232), John Vaughan (279)
2003: Jesus Urbina (300), Makan Konate (#54 among 5th year preps)
2002: Trent Wurtz (237), Jai Lewis (#59 among 5th year preps)
2001: Lamar Butler (134)
I think you can argue that Mason did get a bump up a bit but not substantially given the amount of exposure of the Final Four run. I would expect they would have capitalized better had they sustained their success in the years following 2006. They have been very good by CAA standards, but after you go to a Final Four, CAA standard excellence doesn't neccessarily cut it if you're trying to go for a higher level recruit. I think they have made progress, but not at the expense of other CAA teams, who are all recruiting at a higher level as well.
That sparks a whole different discussion.....I really hate the whole "recruiting" discussion to begin with. The rankings and hype and all that mean nothing if you ask me. I mean, look at the team that Mason took to the Final Four, where were each of those guys "ranked" coming out of high school? All the ODU fans have been telling us for the better part of the past decade that they are bringing in all these Church's Chicken All-Americans and that we are bringing in guys that won't be able to hold their jocks and we all know how that has turned out more times than not!
districtballer
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VCU4LIFE said:
Good point. Rankings only go for so much. That said, some of the cornerstones of Mason's Final Four run were pretty highly regarded high schoolers. Lamar Butler (134), Will Thomas (153), and Jai Lewis (59th among 5th years) were pretty high level recruits. Folarin Campbell (225), Jordan Carter (232), and John Vaughan (279) were a rung lower, but still top 300 level which is pretty good for the CAA.
On the other hand, right following Mason's Final Four run, VCU brought in Joey Rodriguez (100), and Lance Kearse (124) as top 125 talents. Joey has been a role player for us and Lance left the program. Meanwhile, some dude who was ranked #905 named Larry Sanders is now an NBA prospect and one of the top big men in the country.
Heck some dude at #321 in 2005 named Eric Maynor ended up being a top 20 draft pick in the NBA draft this June. He was ranked behind both of George Mason's recruits that year (211 Sammy Hernandez and 263 Chris Fleming). That's like a joke now.
While I agree that rankings count for next to nothing and on-court production is what truly counts, we can't discount that the level of recruit a program attracts is very closely related with the perception of where that program sits on the national stage. While not a strict rule, higher rated players go to more prestigious programs. There's no way of knowing whether the players will neccessarily pan out, but you would usually go with a more highly-regarded player if you had the choice. It's simply a discussion of whether George Mason was able to capitalize on their run. I think the answer is a muted yes, but not nearly the kind of impact one would expect. It was a marginal improvement in terms of the type of recruit they are getting compared to the past.
districtballer
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Rambler said:
He has to wait til the Spring now. I think he could verbally commit if he were so inclined, but he can't sign a LOI until the late period.
BradRamFan
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VCU4LIFE said:
Unless you are a consistent mid-major Big Dance attendee like Gonzaga or Memphis - which GMU is not - then as far as most recruits:
1. It's all about the conference baby!
2. And GMU is only in the CAA.
For what it's worth, ESPN named Mason's 2009 class the No. 1 non-BCS class in the nation. Even if you think ESPN's basketball recruiting stuff pretty much sucks (like I do), that's pretty impressive considering the respect the Worldwide Leader gets.
Whoever said they haven't landed anyone they couldn't have gotten pre-Final 4 is incorrect. In fact, I think most of their team (other than the local guys Long, Tate and Whack) would've wound up elsewhere.
In their 08 class, Cornelius was down to Clemson and Mason before Andre Young signed on his official visit to Clemson. Pearson most likely would've wound up in the Big East (Rutgers coach Hill was hot on his trail) if he hadn't committed early to Mason.
In the 09 class, Larranaga never would've even gotten a foot in the door with guys like Wright (NY), Williams (Memphis), Vaughns (Texas) and Bennett (NJ) without the publicity they got from the Final 4.
Now let's see what they do with all those young kids. That's all that really matters.
Whoever said they haven't landed anyone they couldn't have gotten pre-Final 4 is incorrect. In fact, I think most of their team (other than the local guys Long, Tate and Whack) would've wound up elsewhere.
In their 08 class, Cornelius was down to Clemson and Mason before Andre Young signed on his official visit to Clemson. Pearson most likely would've wound up in the Big East (Rutgers coach Hill was hot on his trail) if he hadn't committed early to Mason.
In the 09 class, Larranaga never would've even gotten a foot in the door with guys like Wright (NY), Williams (Memphis), Vaughns (Texas) and Bennett (NJ) without the publicity they got from the Final 4.
Now let's see what they do with all those young kids. That's all that really matters.
vcu70
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I wonder what recruits were here for the game-I guess none were on "official" visits-you nee a lawyer to interpret NCAA rules. I think Jay Gavin's post game comment was one reason I asked the question-that crowd and atmosphere is the reason I came to VCU. I;m just thinking it may help with a kid who is borderline like apparently so many have been lately.
VCUBeatsduke
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vcu70 said:
I was thinking the same thing...hearing Gavin say that about VCu and the Siegal Center was really cool. My buddy went to Niagara and he says the same thing - small gym, quiet crowd. Compared to the Siegal Center its nothing...
I have to think those recruits were jacked Saturday night.
VCUBeatsduke
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If you want to be big-time, you have to think and act big-time. It's the same adage as "dress for the job you want, not the one you have". VCU needs to schedule bigger, play teams at their place, go after the best recruits, etc. It can't let the relative weakness of the CAA hold the program back. Look at CUSA. Memphis had the # 1 recruiting class in the country (after Pastner picked up a couple of late commits) and CUSA basketball without Memphis is nothing. We can be VIEWED as a major, or at least a non mid-major in the CAA. We need a deep(er) NCAA run though - - Sweet 16, etc.